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[0:07] CK: If of us need extra element about Central African Republic updates, we have now one of the best data we may put collectively yesterday in an article pinned to the highest right here. Alex has been tweeting about it. There’s additionally an official doc that is pinned to the highest. So, bought some respectable assets making an attempt to get some of us on the bottom to discuss it.
[0:30] Alex Gladstein: Well, sure. So, as we get Clément related, Fode, why do not we begin along with your preliminary reactions? Do you simply need to give the viewers a way of perhaps the fast historical past of this nation out of your perspective as somebody who’s a part of the CFA Zone and sort of what this implies to you as somebody who’s a member of what you’d name the French Monetary Union?
[0:55] Fode Diop: Sure. Well, to begin with, thanks for having me right here. I recognize it. Always completely happy to share my ideas and simply insights on stuff that I bought to see occurring in Africa, typically. Yeah, humorous sufficient, I do not know a lot in regards to the Central African Republic as a rustic as an entire as a result of I’m by no means personally been there.
But rising up in Senegal, it was at all times these horror tales coming from there as a result of they had a dictator known as Bokassa. And then whenever you had been children, when your dad and mom need to threaten you, they at all times discuss like sending you to Bokassa’s home as a result of apparently, he preferred to acquire kids’s heads. I’m unsure if it is true. I’m unsure if it is a actuality.
But it was like actually a nightmare rising up truly in listening to a bunch of tales popping out of there as a result of it was a really brutal dictator, who worshiped France and worshiped French monarchy which is sort of bizarre. And he was in energy for a really, very very long time till he lastly bought pushed out and he ended up dying on this fort in France, I consider, which is ironic.
So, once I first heard in regards to the information, like anyone else, I used to be sort of skeptical as a result of we did not hear something main up to it. So, I wasn’t certain if it was simply pretend information, or if it was simply folks simply making an attempt to push articles on the market and making an attempt to fire up some controversies or whatnot.
Because it occurred earlier than in Senegal, like 4, 5 years in the past, there was an article that mentioned that Senegal was about to launch this e-cash and it was broadly shared and publicized, but it surely turned out it was a fabricated story. So, once I noticed this one coming from what we name, in a French, [inaudible], I used to be like, properly, perhaps it is the identical scenario as a result of we have now heard nothing about it wherever in any information. The solely publication that present the article was one thing known as Forbes MC. I consider MC means Monaco.
It could not presumably be true as a result of it got here from this obscure weblog web site. But I ended up simply speaking to a buddy of mine who grew up there and who ended up coming to Senegal to do his grasp’s. And he sort of verified a number of the data, however wasn’t fairly certain. It took me a few days to sort of like get on the backside of it. And I used to be like, okay, properly than speaking to you as properly, Gladstein, that this is a actuality occurring at this time. And I’m enthusiastic about it as a result of I by no means thought in my lifetime that I’d see this occur, truthfully.
Because as a lot as I’m bullish about Bitcoin, as a lot as I work on Bitcoin, I at all times handled it like a pyramid in Egypt. This implies that we are constructing one thing actually revolutionary, that may presumably outlive all of us, we would not get an opportunity to see the outcomes or the fruits of it. So, similar because the folks in Egypt who designed these pyramids. It took them a few thousand years to construct this stuff, however I’m certain they knew that they weren’t going to see the ultimate outcome, however nonetheless devoted effort and time to design and construct this stuff.
So for me, the identical factor I need to see for Africa typically as properly as a result of I do know that I’ve a restricted time on this planet. And I would love to see someday, the outcomes of the efforts and laborious work of the neighborhood and individually. All of the work could be put in collectively, we far as making an attempt to assist Africa come out of this rut that it is in proper now.
To see this occur although, on this lifetime is very promising and I feel it opens up large alternatives for West Africans. It opens up large potentialities for us to lastly circumvent this imperial foreign money they name the franc CFA, finally. And I feel it is an thrilling time forward and I’m personally making an attempt to get to Saint-Affrique as quick as potential. I’m headed to Oslo in a couple of weeks right here with a glass crew. But my purpose is to head straight to CAR proper after that. So, I’m excited.
[5:01] Alex: Fode, whenever you, whenever you learn this invoice, I imply it says that Le Bitcoin is going to be the foreign money of the nation. I imply, how does that make you are feeling?
[5:17] Fode: Well, I’ll be sincere. I’ve combined emotions about that. Because I simply bought again from El Salvador, simply to sort of see I went proper after the convention, as a result of I used to be there a few 12 months in the past or like 7, 8 months in the past after the Bitcoin Conference in 2021. And I went there when they handed a legislation and stayed for some time, and I wished to return once more and see how issues had been present process or whatnot. I used to be disillusioned as a result of I did not see as a lot adoption on the bottom that I hoped for after a couple of months. So, I wasn’t certain if it was due to misinformation, miseducation, or the lack of knowledge per se, I ought to say.
The similar factor going to occur on this specific nation. I had this type of fear a bit. But then once more, I’m going again to saying that Bitcoin is nonetheless pretty younger, nonetheless a young person. It’s about like 12 years outdated or so, and I feel we have not discovered in some way the true purposes of it. And I feel it would take 4 locations I really feel for extra adoption, extra experimentation, and extra constructing, for us to work out what will stick and the way can we finest use this know-how itself.
[6:36] Alex: Yeah, so we’re going to hopefully get Clément up right here to break it down from what he is seeing. But simply to refresh the viewers, this invoice handed on the twenty second. This is a rustic that clearly, as Fode is saying has been by means of loads. It had a string of traditionally notorious dictators going up by means of the early 2000s.
The present chief of the nation is not a dictator; is somebody who was elected in a course of that was praised even by teams just like the UN as a sort of bringing order again to the nation. But I feel it is vital for us to perceive that to begin with, a small nation that is simply been by means of loads. Clément, are you able to hear us?
[7:24] Clément Di Roma: Yeah. Hello, everybody.
[7:26] Alex: Amazing. Okay. Well, let’s simply get to it. If you possibly can hear us, give us your background. How did you wind up in Bangui? And what sort of tales have you ever been protecting over the previous few years?
[7:37] Clément: So, I’m a journalist that has been in Bangui for a few 12 months and a half proper now. And I’ve been protecting every kind of tales, principally associated to the dire humanitarian scenario right here within the Central African Republic. But additionally associated to the safety scenario because the nation now has been in a civil struggle for a couple of a long time and a brand new wave of that civil struggle began only a 12 months a few 12 months in the past.
[8:07] Alex: Can you give us only a fast overview of the humanitarian disaster and who are the actors in The Civil War, and who is the sort of overseas proxies concerned?
[8:17] Clément: So, whenever you’re speaking in regards to the Central African Republic, you will have about 5 million folks as the whole inhabitants. The humanitarian disaster right here represents about half of that inhabitants that is in dire want of [inaudible] well being, but in addition in want of meals. Some folks are missing meals for the time being within the nation, together with in Bangui, the capital.
And when it comes to who’s collaborating within the safety disaster, in fact, the nationwide troops with Russian allies and random troops as properly, however there’s additionally towards them there is armed teams, and insurgent teams that are a bit all over the place within the nation for the time being, and combating has been happening for a few 12 months and some months now, and it is nonetheless happening. So, folks are nonetheless being displaced, killed, and are nonetheless missing meals and primary stuff everywhere in the nation.
[9:21] Alex: Bernard, would love to hear your reactions to what’s occurring right here, from what you are seeing in Nigeria.
[9:29] Bernard Parah: Hey, everybody. Hi, Alex. For me, I’m nonetheless making an attempt to internalize this. It appears surreal, from seeing the primary was, I feel Corey posted this, after which I went to the web site Forbes Monaco and it simply would not look legit as a result of I’d by no means have guessed in 1,000,000 years that it is the Central African Republic that may make this vital transfer. We had been simply discussing the opposite day if this occurred, what it meant for them?
First, wanting on the colonization by France, CFA and what it meant for the African international locations to say, “Okay, look. Maybe everyone has been looking to see what will happen with El Salvador maybe six months down the line. If we attempted this, can we attempt it?” And if we attempted, I was going to be like right.
For us, it’s just watching and discussing how can we support them. This is the first move, gave me the first move. So, now they’re going to be dependent on the community that will be dependent on Bitcoiners from more African countries and the whole world to get behind them. And just help them do this because what happens in situations like these is, apart from the IMF from France, we also have in just general.
Everyone called me with a crypto project, all of a sudden saying do this, do that, and focusing on how they’re going to liberate these people. Because if we look at the economic indices in that country, it’s really poor. But then, for them, they are one of these countries that going to quickly find utility in this because when you look at the announcements talking about making payments, talking about IMF circumventing all of these capital controls around. It just makes a lot of sense that they’re doing this and honestly, I still haven’t fully internalized this. I want to travel there as soon as I can to just go understand what is happening. But it’s exciting, at the same time.
[11:48] Alex: Just to fill in what I think Clément was telling me earlier. So, hopefully, he’ll hop up in and be able to give more detail. But just as a reminder again, this is a country with a civil war. There’s a proxy war happening between the government which is backed by the Russians, and the Rwandans, and then just a whole bunch of rebel groups. This is a country that’s bordering Darfur. There are millions of people who are displaced as he said, I think 90% of the people don’t have access to electricity. If you just think about that for a second, only 10% or so people have access to the internet or could conceivably use Bitcoin. And it’s interesting to look at the process here.
Again, the leader of the country is not a dictator. And doesn’t have control over the whole country. But there are concerns around the government. There are concerns around low turnout around elections and just hoping Clément could fill us in hopefully a little bit more on the sort of the proceedings. But this bill has been debated, basically for a month there, and it passed unanimously, but I think that’s a little misleading.
Because of some of the opposition, this wasn’t like El Salvador where it was just sort of pushed through in a day or whatever. There was a whole like a month, apparently if back and forth and it did pass “unanimously.” But I think a lot of the opposition politicians who didn’t support it just sort of weren’t there the day when the vote happened.
But in many events, the same criticisms that you see in El Salvador are at play here. Most people won’t be able to use it. It’s going to be an opportunity for scams, which we’ll get into, and people just don’t understand. The average person doesn’t understand why this has been done. I think there are some interesting positives and some interesting things to be concerned about.
We’re trying to have Clément back in, so hopefully, he’ll join. And I want to get his thoughts on the actual bill itself and how it came to be. But just wanted to set the stage for you all in terms of the data of just how kind of underdeveloped his country is, again, the second least developed country in the world and very much a sort of a sad outcome of the Colonial French system. So, we’ll get him in here. But again…
[14:19]: CK: Alex.
[12:19] Alex: Yeah. Hey, what’s up?
[14:21] CK: I guess I’m kind of curious you wrote in for many Bitcoiners. You’re the first person that educated many people about this CFA Franc system and that was less than a year ago. I think it was September 21 when you wrote about it. I guess in…
[14:36] Alex: I guess, I think it was in June, but yeah.
[14:38] CK: Sorry, June. Okay, but I guess, what was it like writing about this thing, and then less than a year after one of the countries within that block is adopting Bitcoin. And you were one of the first people that suggested that Bitcoin could be a good solution.
[14:53] Alex: Yeah, I mean it’s surreal because I just spent a lot of time at the suggestion of Fode and friends looking at the history of the colonial Franc which like, obviously was under-discussed in international politics, but the TLDR is that the French government controls the economic fate of 180 million people through the currency.
So, people in 15 African countries still use the French system, which is ultimately still controlled by Paris and its proxies. It used to be more directly controlled through Paris. Today, it’s controlled kind of a little more indirectly. But the point is that people in these countries want to resist this system. Maybe not the leaders. The leaders tend to be dictators who are supported by the French government.
But people have been starting to push out and trying to create resistance movements to get away from this system. I think that if anything, the fact that this is happening regardless of the intentions and I’ll get to why we think this happened in a second, the impact is going to be pretty huge because all of a sudden people across the whole CFA zone are going to be talking at a higher rate about Bitcoin and cryptocurrency.
And I think that’s going to have some positive effects. I mean people are kind of forced to reckon with it and it’s just astonishing to think about the fact that this currency that was invented by somebody, that we don’t even know who they are, not that long ago, it’s now the currency, if you had another nation, it’s just kind of a surreal thing.
But as far as the bill itself, I would encourage people to look at the bill. I guess we have Olumide up on the stage here who I’ll get to in a second. But in my opinion, the bill is unworkable. So, what’s interesting about the bill is that the bill refers to Bitcoin kind of at the outset. But then, throughout the admittance of the bill, it talks about cryptocurrency or crypto money in French.
But essentially, what’s interesting about the bill is it says that from what I can understand, and again, hoping to get Clément’s thoughts on this, is that it says that debts in the country have to be repaid in cryptocurrency. And that the central bank has to convert cryptocurrency to legal tender.
And the worrying thing here is there’s a guy who helped push this through, a business guy from the region who’s super shady and has had a lot of Ponzi schemes. There are worries that like he pushed this through and that he made it so that even though it’s a Bitcoin kind of law that there’s like crypto, it’s defined as cryptocurrency loosely.
So, what does that mean? That this guy can just create a whole bunch of tokens and then go to the central bank and redeem them for CFA francs. It’s a little strange here. So, I don’t know if Clément is back here. Clément, can you hear us?
[18:00] CK: Seems like he’s having a lot of issues.
[18:02] Alex: Yeah, it’s okay will be patient. Hopefully, he’ll pipe back in later. But Clément just speak up anytime that you can and we’ll come back to you. We have to be patient as his troubles are indicative of it, the country, and the fact that the internet is so bad there. But anyway, I would encourage people to look at the actual bill and start to understand that as is, it’s not workable.
I mean, maybe it ends up being de facto, the law of the land in the coming months, but the bill itself was hit, not well put together, and doesn’t make a lot of sense in as much as it doesn’t define what cryptocurrency is. Like what does that mean? Does that mean Shiba coin? Does that mean, what? It’s really strange. So, Olumide, do you want to weigh in on this at all? I know you’re up. Go ahead, man.
[18:50] Olumide Adesina: Yeah, so I listened to all your analysis, and very interesting. But, as an African and I speak with any crypto space in Africa, I’ll tell you that I performed the fact that, is our CAR adoption of Bitcoin looks to be more symbolic, it has to be systemic.
Now, the narrative is that the Central African Republic is a poor country. I beg to differ because you need to understand that it’s a country that is very rich in mineral resources despite its GDP falling about five billion dollars and it’s wrong to turn around 168 and the world in terms of world standing. It means that there have been conflicts and weak institutions in play to see colonial powers and foreign powers taking trying to sway those resources.
And that is why the country tends to be poor. And if you look at internet penetration also because of weak institutions and the lack of stability, we can’t see the things we see in North African countries. But I will say that I think it’s not just symbolic, they’ve seen the importance, because you take the case of Nigeria, for example. Nigeria happens to be Africa’s biggest economy home to 200 million people.
And if you look at statistics, although Niger has political instability growing challenges, you [inaudible], and some form of overpopulation that just seems to be topping the crypto market in terms of YouTube users around the world. And that’s because Remington’s use of Bitcoin has attracted so many Nigerians, apart from Salvador, that’s because they have a poor President that is supposed to improve Bitcoin President. Despite Nigeria’s institutions don’t support the crypto Market, that hasn’t deterred Nigeria.
So, that has true for African countries. A lot of people forget that. Another thing you need to also understand is that one in every three Africans is Nigerian. So that has also pushed Bitcoin adoption across Africa in a very aggressive way because trust me a lot of Africans used the crypto market. So, that’s why you see big labels that FDX, Binance, and crypto.com setting business here. They understand the systemic adoption that is coming into the market.
Now, if you look at Paxos for example, Paxos which came in 5, 6 years ago in Nigeria, is the biggest market in the world. So, what I’m just trying to tell you is that while we are focusing on the property or focusing on the French and Greek on CAR, I think we’re losing the context of what Bitcoin is gripping the African continent.
And it’s just the start because if you look at the technology if you look at the number of developers coming from that continent alone and statistics suggest the last a loan the amount of money that came from crypto-sponsored projects in Africa was in billions of dollars.
And that just tells you that the attraction is building up, and the momentum despite the fact the market looks like is moderating, the attention is getting a lot of bubble from young people because on the average and crypto developers and more than many professionals in the African continent.
I think we should look at the dynamics Bitcoin has done in CAR and like I said, to be pretty much all fair to look at the fact that the nation is really poor based on their output, I look inward, not forgetting inward that this country has so many resources and that’s why you could see the French trying to make a grip on the country.
I think if there’s stability if we Africans can start to get their actions together [inaudible] or certainty reduces and because we have a pretty much young population. I think the dynamics we have to the crypto market and that’s why Bitcoin is having that grip in Africa, so I felt like highlighting those points.
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[24:36] CK: Thank you. Okay, so I’m working on getting Clément just…
[24:37] Alex: I got my phone and I’ll put him on speaker, but I got to look to go back to you…
[24:41] CK: I got him, Alex.
[24:42] Alex: Oh, you got him? Okay, great. Go ahead.
[24:44] Clément: Yeah, I think I can speak now and it should work fine.
[24:28] Alex: Okay, perfect. That’s amazing. Thank you so much, CK. So, Clément, just going back to the background of the bill. We kind of covered the humanitarian situation, the lack of internet penetration. When did you first start hearing about the bill and can you talk to us about what’s been happening the last few weeks?
[25:07] Clément: So, we first heard about the bill a few months ago. When you look at a specific businessman that lives in Cameroon, the country next started to talk about crypto [unintelligible] it’s doping that was never on the table with politicians even less than the population. You’ve talked about the lack of internet. Electricity, smartphone, and the internet are way too expensive here. And you’ve been trying to get me this evening and the internet is super bad.
The development of this bill quite seems quite shady because it’s linked to a specific businessman that lives in Cameroon and made some shady investments, made some weird contacts with the President as well. And has been already accused of trying to scam people on the continent in the region of Sierra and Cameroon as well by international authorities, individuals, by companies also. So it’s a shady case on how this deal came to be.
[26:20] Alex: And can you talk about the back and forth between the opposition, the civil society, and the government? And how did it come to pass sort of unanimously?
[26:30] Clément: So it didn’t quite pass unanimously because there were three deputies from the opposition that was part of the commission to defrock this bill. There was a special commission that was put in place to try and develop a bill that would try and be passed next at the National Assembly. But the opposition seems like they realized during the process that maybe it wasn’t transparent, and it wasn’t what they expected.
So they elect the commission before the final report of that commission developed this bill. It was on the table for the National Assembly to vote and now they’ve communicated, they’re protesting, because this bill isn’t what they wanted, and they’re saying that it could lead to money laundering and tax evasion. This sort of stuff.
[27:26] Alex: What about civil society? When you say civil society, what do you mean? Do you mean like independent media? I mean, what do you mean by that?
[27:34] Clément: Yeah, so civil society is association organizations of people in the Central African Republic that I think sometimes published opinions, and some opinions are very well defined because the freedom of speech here is very relative. Some of those organizations that are politically motivated are also protesting against this bill saying it won’t do anything for the regular send traffic and because people here don’t have smartphones, and don’t have internet or electricity.
And that is mostly just for the 1% in the government and that they probably won’t be used anytime soon for proper use by the people and that it would only be used for purposes that are quite illegal on the international scale.
[28:30] Alex: Yes. So, when you’re looking at the bill itself and the different articles like do any of them seem particularly surprising to you? I mean, I know that you and I were talking about 22 and 23, which makes it seem like debts could be repaid with “cryptocurrency,” that the central bank would have to redeem cryptocurrency for Francs, like what?
I guess in your mind this bill is not workable. What do you think is going to happen in the next few months? I mean, do you think this will fizzle out or do you think that it’ll get modified and kind of tightened up?
[29:08] Clément: So, my opinion is that the bill will probably stay the same even though the opposition has pressed forward to the constitutional consul that should say if it’s a constitutional bill or not and maybe make some changes. But I think most articles don’t see how they don’t have the infrastructure, they don’t have the network to put in place those specific types of transactions, insurance, and even that depending on creating an agency that regulates the exchange.
But I don’t think that will happen anytime soon because it’s a complex thing to do, maybe in a few years. But at the moment, the country isn’t very much dire state. And it’s not the financial priority to put this system in place. So for me, it won’t be in place for years.
[30:04] Alex: Now, I guess the question is if you have a business and you’re doing something like remittance or commerce within the neighboring state that this bill would make it like may be easier for you or let’s say less unclear if you’re trying to do business and you don’t want to deal with the exchange with the CFA Franc. Maybe you just want to use Bitcoin or stable coins or something. I guess that’s the optimistic view.
The negative view would be that this was rigged up by this guy that you mentioned, this kind of Ponzi scheme architect. And that maybe he just did this so that he and the government can kind of launch a bunch of corrupt schemes and then get paid out at the expense of the citizenry. I mean, what are your thoughts on these two opinions?
[31:00] Clément: That’s opinion is very valid. It could be really good for the country and future investments and business people that want to invest in the CAR and for everyone really that has CFA Franc, it’s much better to trade in crypto this year because it’s hard to get money in out and to do an exchange with the CAR and outside of this year.
But for sure, this bill was developed in very weird condition. I think there’s probably a shady part to it, but it could translate to real improvements on the drug transaction side. But at the moment the country is very much lacking the infrastructure to do this.
And most people here, I would say even people that have a stable job that that have like medium revenues don’t know about crypto. They don’t know what it is. Most people here, don’t use the internet at all. So, it would take a few years. I think it’s good to have legal grounds to organize all of this. But we would have to see if there’s a political will to put in place all of those things or if it’s just a big scam and if it was pushed by the government with a specific purpose.
[32:21] Alex: So, there’s been a lot of speculation about this Twitter account that’s popped up of the President. You were telling me that the President told you it’s real and that you’ve been getting information from them. Can you just talk about that? Like that you were telling me you think that the Twitter account is real, but it’s just kind of maybe like mismanaged or something.
[32:45] Clément: Yes. So, we have confirmation that the Twitter account was real. It was created I think just a few weeks ago and a week ago. But so far, there’s been a lot of tweets that are just about cryptocurrency. So, that seems super weird to us because there are a lot of other issues like diplomatic issues as a lot of news in the CAR, lot of reactions that I expected from the present the other than just talking about cryptocurrency.
Also, when I was talking about mismanagement, it’s mostly that people have mocked online this Twitter account because there’s so much bad spelling. Some sentences don’t even make much sense. And unfortunately, it’s the President ’s account, it should be really clean and use some complex sentences…
[33:45] Alex: Yeah, so, the…
[33:46] Clément: …[unintelligible] of the case.
[33:48] Alex: So, the truth is stranger than fiction here. So, you think there’s a small group of people basically who are using this account on behalf of the President, or like, how knowledgeable do you think he is about this bill and the statements? Do you feel like from what you’ve seen, his office is supporting this? Or is this something that’s being kind of like done without their knowledge?
[34:13] Clément: I think his office and himself are supporting the bill. I think it’s done with his knowledge because it’s done. I think it is with his signature, the bill was signed by him, and is it shows to communicate about it in a very strong manner, on an international scale as well as the story once was blown up and it seems to tweet about this because it’s getting a lot of attention, as well, or at least you seem.
Yeah. At the moment, I think it’s just bad sentences, bad formulation, and maybe they are putting forward the story and narrative of this specific communication team that couldn’t be put forward because that’s not what the people here in CAR already expect from the President, expect of much better communication. And communication about just other topics and then this one.
[35:09] Alex: Yeah. I mean, look. You’re going to get a ton of interest and engagement from the world in the coming months that just didn’t exist before. So, again, maybe some good can come of it. In the West African countries that are under the CFA Franc, there’s like resistance movements against it. Is there any resistance against the Franc in and the sort of the colonial franc in the CAR? Or is it not something that’s a political movement there?
[35:37] Clément: So, political movement is about this are very small in the CAR at the moment. I think that some people aren’t happy with the CFA Franc, of course. It’s been a long project to create a unified currency. And I think, it’s just really good projects they should put in place, but there are no real political movements at the moment to end the CFA Franc in the Central African Republic.
And there are certainly no movements. I don’t know, political movements at all, and in the population, in general, to replace the CFA Franc with the cryptocurrency just because people won’t be able to use it for decades, I would say in the CAR, because the infrastructures are just not here to even be able to connect people.
[36:27] Alex: Can you give us some details about Russia’s involvement? We know that France withdrew troops recently. I mean, would it be fair to say that France is kind of withdrawing its influence in a way, whereas Russia’s moving in? Can you talk about the Wagner Group and how it works with the President?
[36:44] Clément: So, there are some issues that I won’t talk about and I can talk about France withdrawing from the country. For sure they had a military operation there until 2016. And when they have withdrawn, Russia took their place with military support, paramilitary support, and the support of Great Britain has been much bigger recently because there was a new wave of violence and Russia held this year to get out of this specific year a wave of violence at the bottom.
So, all I can say, France, it’s losing ground. There wasn’t a recent withdrawal of troops because there were no troops. There was recent funding from France, following accusations by the UN, and other NGOs, violations of human rights by the national army, and bombing terrorists, but it wasn’t French troops withdrawing. It was just some militaries about to withdraw and major information will bring [inaudible]…
[38:02] Alex: Now, with first Russia’s involvement, why would they be there? I mean, can you talk about some of the natural resources that are in this small country? Like why is it a strategic interest to foreign powers?
[38:13] Clément: So, in the CAR this has always been their strategic country, for a lot of foreign policy has been for France for decades and decades, and even centuries at that point. But yes, a lot of countries are involved here and I was thinking about Russia, specifically, but they’re involved here to access some natural resources, including mines that are hard to access.
It has been of interest for a lot of countries but is known as being able to make a profit out of its or do build a stable mining exchange system or industry here because it’s hard with armed groups. So, it’s still really stable at the moment. But yes, foreign powers, Russians are interested and attracted to the Central African Republic at the moment.
[39:04] Alex: You were saying that half the country is in a humanitarian crisis. From what we understand, only about again, 10% have access to the internet, and only about 10 to 15 percent of access to the grid electricity. I assume you’ve tracked around a little bit. I mean, can you talk to us about what life is like outside of the capitals and what people are dealing with?
[39:28] Clément: Yes, the humanitarian situation here is dire at the moment. So, you can imagine 2.5 million people. Half the population is in lacks food, humanitarian agencies are not enough to save everyone. People don’t have access to food or clean water. They don’t have access to health centers. They don’t have access to healthcare and people live with very little money every day, even here in the capital, Bangui has slightly 1% or even less of people that can afford a smartphone, for example.
So, life is really tough in the CAR for everyone. And when you go out of the capital, that’s nothing. There’s no infrastructure. There’s no internet. In most places, if there’s no antenna doesn’t you’re lucky to get a signal in the cities outside of the capital. Very little infrastructure and no roads. There are just a few paved roads here in Bangui, but the most cases, no roads are all over. So, yeah. At the moment, at least in the country, we’re talking about crypto.
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[41:37] Alex: One more question and then I want to turn it over to Fode, to allow him to ask some questions of you, as someone who is born into the CFA Zone. But can you talk about the money piece like currently, you were saying, maybe this law could be the beginning of something that eventually may impact people positively because of, I guess how broken it is? But if you need to send a payment to France or the United States, I assume this isn’t so easy. Can you talk a little bit about kind of how problematic I guess the money system is today?
[42:11] Clément: It seems super problematic for everyone in the Central African Republic, especially because people at least here in the capital can often live off the money that is sent by the people living outside of the country. [inaudible] here maybe you say it in English better. So, they have a member of the family that’s in Europe and they want to send money but it’s tough. You have to use sometimes Western Union, Express Union, and other services, but it’s really expensive.
People lose a lot of money doing that. It takes a long time as well. You need paper. Sometimes just mistakes. Sometimes there’s a thief and the banks here are very isolated. The CAR is a very isolated country because of all the crises. Even for people here is tough to get and send money. And also just to do business, we go a bit outside and everywhere.
Like you want to invest here, bring money, or I know to live with money, it’s super hard. Very, very complicated. And the crypto could try to make that part of the Central African life a bit better if people had access to infrastructure, [inaudible], and the internet.
[43:42] Alex: Roughly speaking, how much would like it to cost to rent a one-bedroom apartment in Bangui? Or you know, what is the daily wage in Sifa. Do you have any rough ideas? Rough numbers for us?
[43:51] Clément: So, I have to convert in my head quickly but per month, some people would get between fifty and a hundred dollars. That would be the regular wage for people that are maybe functionaries that are working at administrations and stuff and get $100 a month if they’re lucky.
And it’s a complex question because the UN Mission is here as well. There are a lot of NGOs. So, for experts here, for international people, the rents are too expensive because it’s really hard to get this… [icrosstalk]
[44:29] Alex: So, $100 a month… [crosstalk]
[44:36] Clément: It’s very costly to get a home, but it surely’s nonetheless an enormous a part of the wage. I’d say you may get a month in most neighborhoods for about $30.
[44:44] Alex: Last factor. The IMF has just lately spoken out, Clément, about this and type of mentioned, they’re not so certain about this. You had been saying that that is going to be a critical subject on the authorities degree and that perhaps the opposition is anxious that a number of the assist that is vital to feed folks shall be reduce off. Do you need to discuss that in any respect?
[45:05] Clément: It could be an enormous drawback certainly as a result of the IMF and most International donors to the CAR, which is half of the nationwide funds right here, they’re very suspicious of this legislation, they assume they get cash laundering scams and all of this. So, they don’t desire to put cash in to ship some huge cash to a rustic the place it may possibly simply get out.
Easily be misplaced, and simply transferred with little or no management and is already very restricted. They have already got very restricted management over that cash. I do not assume they see this legislation as one thing that makes the scenario higher in any respect within the Central African Republic, at the very least, as worldwide donors.
[45:50] Alex: Fode, do you will have any questions for Clément?
[45:53] Fode: Oh, certain. Clément merci beaucoup pour tout, I hope to see you on the market quickly. Well, my solely query is that what do you assume has been the reception from monetary establishments like banks and such? Has it been optimistic or have they been quiet? Because I’ve been wanting on-line and I could not fairly see how they obtained that, the information, mainly in regards to the Bitcoin authorized tender. What do you assume like general feeling is?
[46:22] Clément: I do not assume there’s not numerous French-based banks within the nation for the time being, principally regional banks. And I imply, they did not react thus far as a result of it is so new and lots of people have heard about this invoice being handed, however not lots of people thought that this invoice would go so rapidly and that we might discuss it so rapidly.
So far, no reactions. I do not assume it would change a lot for them for the time being. But if the federal government has to implement new protocols and stuff they most likely will not be completely happy as a result of it is already very complicated for them to function in Central Africa and the Central African Republic. So, I’ll have to test their reactions later.
[47:10] Fode: Awesome, thanks.
[47:11] Alex: Okay. Thank you. Bernard, do you will have any questions on Clément whereas we have now them?
[47:16] Bernard: No, I do not. I feel you have requested the query is all about to ask. Thank you, Clément.
[47:22] Alex: Awesome. Well, look. Thank you, Clément, a lot in your time. This has been nice. It’s good for us to hear from somebody there. Just to repeat to conclude for the viewers, this is actual. The invoice is actual. The Twitter account is actual. This is occurring, however we’re simply unsure in regards to the affect as a result of so few folks have entry to the web.
I suppose the charitable perspective could be that it might be the beginning of one thing that might be useful for many individuals as a result of this monetary system is so damaged. And so sort of corrupted by middlemen, by charges, and by unworkable completely different currencies that, yeah, perhaps an open-source permissionless foreign money, that may be equal for everyone would over time, make a distinction. And I feel that is why most of us are right here.
But I feel we’d like to be clear that the one that pushed this legislation, most probably, was somebody with like like shady enterprise pursuits, and Clément what occurs is, perhaps that perhaps the invoice will get clarified to Bitcoin and digital {dollars} or one thing a little bit extra sort of clear. Because proper now, the invoice is identical to so huge open that it does go away room for scams.
Because if crypto cash or no matter is going to be one thing that wants to be handled on the nationwide degree. For somebody like me, I simply really feel like that is going to be an issue. So, I do not know. Do you will have any closing ideas for us? Again, very grateful in your time.
[49:02] Clément: Thanks for thus summing that up. I feel it has been good. So yeah, this invoice may make the scenario higher right here, however nobody within the International Community and no different international locations of people or businessmen ought to anticipate this invoice to be applied any time quickly. This may say the enterprise happening as a result of it is so huge open.
We’ve seen that it is open. I do not assume it would get modified. It will most likely keep because it is. And we’ll see within the month within the years to come what comes out of this invoice. I imply, thus far, it is actually laborious to say. And it is laborious to think about folks right here within the Central African Republic, truly utilizing crypto anytime quickly.
[49:46] Alex: Well, once more, thank you may be following you for updates. One last item I believed I’d throw on the market was that the nation I feel is half powered by Hydro assets for no matter electrical energy they do have. The relaxation, I consider is diesel basically, however one thing to control actually, if folks are listening who need to discover a method to assist. I feel the attention-grabbing factor, Clément, is like, what this invoice does supply is methods for folks to assist.
I imply earlier than this invoice, let’s put it this manner. Most folks have by no means heard of this nation and possibly would reside the remainder of their lives with out ever listening to it. But now you are going to have lots of people worldwide who’ve heard about it and who are . And look a few of these folks are going to carry by means of with precise good intentions and are going to deliver commerce and they are going to deliver capital and it is going to be attention-grabbing.
So, we glance ahead to listening to from you about what’s happening on the bottom. And yeah, once more, thanks a lot in your time, and I recognize the viewers right here for battling with us by means of these web points. Thank you, CK, you are a champ for getting Clément in your cellphone. Again, we’ll be following you. Thank you all a lot for coming. And CK, I do not know in order for you to pitch something right here on the finish. But yeah, thanks.
[51:00] CK: Thanks, everybody. Appreciate Alex for organizing this. It’s very, very informative. You bought folks on the bottom and I can inform that numerous Bitcoiners had been keen to be taught firsthand to get data. So, I recognize you in the neighborhood.
[51:15] Alex: Thank you, everyone. Thank you, Clément. We’ll see you guys later. Take care. Thank you, Fode. Thank you, Bernard.
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